Man erkennt eine AG-5B auch am T-frmigen Gashebel. With a fixed-pitch propeller and fixed gear, it is simple to operate. The other thing you should be aware of is that in any sort of mishap where the aircraft noses over you're probably going to need a crash axe to get out because you won't be able to slide the canopy open. Tiger owners report cruise speeds of 125 to 133 knots at 8.5 to 10 gallons per hour, while owners with 160 hp Cheetahs fly about 10 knots slower with a slightly lower fuel burn. ). Its hard to beat a tandem seat aerobatic aircraft when it comes to fun. It will also carry more weight, as mentioned above. I was gonna ask him the same thing. Depending on how much exposure it has to the sun, it will need to be replaced generally about every 25 to 30 years. The final variant of the AA-5 line was the AA-5B Tiger. assistance. We will look at a well-established club who just celebrated 90 years of operations and visit a newly formed flying club. She first obtained a fixed-wing Private Pilots Licence 25 years ago. Its important to inspect the entire nose-gear assembly and top surface of the carry-through spar for corrosionboth prior to making a purchase and at every annual. This month we will compare the two aircraft the Flying Educators have operated in their 57-year history the Citabriaand theGrumman Tiger. Does he have it on Barnstormers, Trade a Plane etc. And its either retractable, more horse power or probably both, OR AN RV which won't carry nearly as much. They're thrifty to run, simple to maintain, light on the controls and have great visibility with their sliding canopies. The lineage began with Jim Bedes homebuilt BD-1, which first flew in 1963. The 172 is basically the big sister to the 152-it's a nearly identical airframe, just larger in every dimension to hold four people. Our Citabria wasnt re-covered during the time Flying Educators owned it, Greg said. Private and Commercial helicopter licenses and Instructor Rating were quickly added to her resume. $19.99 . There is a beautiful Grumman at my airport for sale. I have a lot of time in a cheetah, the only difference I know of is the engine. login you will see the new forum. With the assistance of aircraft designer Roy LoPresti, the airframe was cleaned up to reduce drag, the horizontal stabilizer was enlarged to increase elevator authority and expand the CG range, and fuel capacity went from 37 to 52 gallons. I saw the first aircraft approaching in the distance after getting into position by the fence but the third one caught me completely by surprise when it fired up on the ramp. Some pilots do not, since although they can see really well beneath the aircraft in the cruise, visibility in the circuit/pattern can be difficult. Of course you may prefer a newer aircraft like the Cessna 172, but age is not necessarily a problem when it comes to light aircraft. Unless you want to go off airport. It will keep up with an Arrow. ). They are both basically a means to make aerial journeys, designed for touring or simply pleasure flying. Fuse to Circuit Breakers - Grumman Style: Replacing your old fuse holders with Klixon 7277-2 series circuit breakers. Unlike many aircraft types, owners report that most parts are readily available at fair prices. Tiger owner here. Its hard to beat a tandem seat aerobatic aircraft when it comes to fun. That wood isn't 50 years old and it is glued to a steel frame including a roll cage cabin. The Tiger I fly is 900lbs. Aero on Demand, a Houston-based club, also operates a Tiger and it is equipped with an engine monitor providing very accurate data. Die Grumman-Tiger-Familie im Steckbrief AG-5B haben eine praktische, auf beiden Seiten aufklappbare Cowling und ein verbessertes Heizungs- und Lftungssystem. Through various ownership changes, such as Bellanca and now American Champion Aircraft Corporation, the simple, well-liked design has continued on with additional variations being produced such as the Decathlon and Scout. , which as you know is fully aerobatic, Greg said. Everybody was used to flyingCitabrias, which as you know is fully aerobatic, Greg said. How do I I have been googling like a mad man learning about them. This helps tremendously because all of the cost of ownership, flight and maintenance are all shared equally among the 4 partners. Bill & Carol Scott, who own the high-compression STC, don't have the resources to do the full testing and certification protocol themselves, so the modified Cheetah is artificially limited to 157 hp to conform to the original specs. And, if you are doing aerobatics, you need parachutes that need to be repacked regularly, which would add a cost. Approximately half are ADS-B-compliant, and most have midtime engines. The club usesAvemcoand pays $6,000 a year, but Greg noted that Florida is an expensivestate in whichto insure an aircraft because of hurricanes and the fact the state is highly litigious. (I'm at Hollywood aviation in the plane ports. Come join us! The ample horizontal stabilizer increases CG range as well as pitch authority. Both are inexpensive to operate and maintai. One letter called the new Cessna 172 "the rough technological and stylisticequivalent of a 1966 Chevy Novaat the price of two Mercedes." Another called the announced $124,500 base price of the new Skyhawk"incredible" and suggested that $75,000 or $80,000 would be appropriate. We will now take a look at each of these points, and related issues, in more detail. And a little more economically., Mike from Aero on Demand added, Besides the RV, its the fastest 180-hp airplane out there with a fixed-pitch prop. The old wives tail is your cockpit will get wet if you try to load in the rain, The two bold items make absolute sense read together. They can provide anything for the airplanewheels, wheel pants, windshields, cowlings, anything you need for a Tiger or similar Grumman aircraftthey can provide.. Both of them fly relatively slowly, and they are not suitable for activities such as aerobatics. Free shipping . Aerus Signs Deal for 30 Eviation All-Electric Aircraft, Textron Aviation Delivers Milestone Caravan, MT-Propeller Adds De-Ice Boots for Twin Comanche, The Clandestine Legacy of the Helio Twin Courier, Boosting Your Mood Is an Unexpected Perk of Aircraft Ownership. The Citabria breed has an AD requiring a one-time inspection of the wooden spar where they have to check it for cracks. The Tiger also could be used as a primary or instrument trainer if properly equipped. The Tiger was designed by Grumman engineers and was first produced in late 1974 as the 1975 model. Depending on how much exposure it has to the sun, it will need to be replaced generally about every 25 to 30 years. Every Cessna 172 or Cherokee 140 I fly with is quickly left in the dust by a good 10 to 15 knots. You should know that, despite the above, there are possibly more similarities than differences between the Cessna 172 and the Cessna 150. It s the same friendly, informative place for all things Cessna 172, now with a larger group of pilots and state-of-the-art forum software. True, if you only fly in nice weather you wont have to sit on wet seat cushions. AA-5B Tiger. And what was involved in getting it approved? Grumman produced the AA5B Tiger from 1975 through 1979, and then American General produced the AG5B Tiger from 1991 through 1993. There should be few problems with maintenance for either of these aircraft types. Bill & Carol Scott, who own the high-compression STC, don't have the resources to do the full testing and certification protocol themselves, so the modified Cheetah is artificially limited to 157 hp to conform to the original specs. If so did he sell it after 2 or 3 years and get into a twin? What are real world numbers for these two at 75%? Grumman Tiger. Otherwise, owners report that the AA-5 family is largely free of issues, and they enjoy great support and parts availability from companies such as Excel-Air Services in Indiana and Fletchair in Texas. You can literally fly with your pinkies.. Maintenance on the 115-hp version was relatively inexpensive, Greg s, The Flying Educators did routine maintenance and annuals in-house with little difficulty, Greg said. I'd take one over a 172 in a heartbeat. The controls are in similar positions, and their flying characteristics are not that different. Otherwise I can take a photo of the for sale sign at the airport sometime. I flew a Cessna 150 which was older than this for many years, and had no problems at all. Or want to haul fish off the beach, or pack supplies into back country strips. You solo it from thefront so youve got good visibility, and, like the Champ it is derived from, it is an easy, forgiving airplane. n, and a lot of fun to fly. human checkbox, which will verify that you are indeed a human. Now Krish does have 3 other partners who own the airplane with him. many destinations within a 500-mile radius, including the Bahamas. So please dont just leap into a Cessna 172 with no experience and expect it to be just like the Cessna 150; it is different. And that was the main consideration.. Its roll rate is faster than a Piper or Cessna. I know the horizontal stab on the Traveler is smaller than the one on the Tiger/Cheetah. I don't think you'll find any Cheetahs which weigh in at only 1314 lb empty -- 1400 is more typical. The plane cruised at around 115 mph and had about a 20-gallon fuel tank, Greg recalled. Similar four-seatGrummansinclude the 150-hp AA5 Traveler and AA5A Cheetah, and the 160-hp GA7 Cougar. 2023 The Grumman Owners and Pilots Association. If you dont have an existing login on the Cessna 172 Club The Grumman Pilots Association and Grumman Gang are additional resources, and enthusiastic support is available to the owner community in the form of online forums and video tutorials. According to Greg, the 115-hpCitabria burned about 5 to 6 gph, making it economical to operate. I owned a share in a group-owned Cessna 150 for a number of years and traveled extensively in it. I did. Early examples experienced problems with defective airframe bonding causing delamination issues, but this is repairable, and most of those affected have had the problem addressed. Youre going to get more airspeed out of a Tiger than youre going to get out of most four-place aircraft in that category, Greg said. What are the main differences between them? Every time I think of trading up, I have a hard time thinking of selling a really good airplane , The Cessna 150 is the best simple and economical airplane one could ask to own. I put about 1500 hours on the F model until I traded it around 1970.. Devoid of rivets and corrugated aluminum, its the secret behind the AA-5s speed. One consideration is that. ). You all are so wrong. A number of these became known as Gulfstream Americans when Gulfstream bought the Grumman line and sold them through 1979. :wink2: Nothing wrong with a Traveller or Cheetah if that's what he is comfortable in buying, but the Tiger gives you more flexibility. The clubwanted an airplane better suited for cross-country travelandthey settled on the Grumman AA5B Tiger. Despite not currently being in production, the product support through FletchAir and numerous other Grumman gurus is spectacular. Grumman Tiger over taking Cessna 150 at + 50 kts. It was largely a matter of economics, Greg said. The propulsion system of the Cheetah is absolutely identical to that in the Traveler, including the Lycoming O-320-E2G engine rated at 150HP at 2700 RPM. They have an unnamed policy, meaning they dont have to list their members or their flight time, so anyone who joins the club is insured. It's faster than a 172 and carries about the same load (typically about 800-850 lb useful), but is not as tolerant of grass or extremely short runways. As a small pilot, with a great deal of experience in the Cessna 150, I most definitely prefer it. With a fuel burn at cruise of around 5 GPH, she does better than my Chevy S10. Although the airplane hasnt been manufactured for quite some time, Greg said parts are easy to get. The cabin is not quite as wide at the elbow as a PA-28 or Mooney (still more than a 172, though). It could also be used for simple aerobatic training things like aileron rolls, loops, spins, and upset recovery. Visibility is amazing. The system will FletchAir down at Boerne Stage (5C1) is the regional guru of Grumman. However, there are still a huge number being flown. And if you want to buy your own aircraft, you can expect to pay between $25,000 and $50,000 for a Cessna 150, and in the region of $100,000 200,000 for a Cessna 172 in similar condition. We havent had any major problems with the Tiger.Aero on Demand said annuals without squawksrun about $1,200 depending on the going rate in your part of the country. The sliding, glass-rich canopy can be flown partially open in flight, adding to the pilots unique experience in this series. With relatively few problem areas, ADs or areas of concern with regard to flying characteristics, the AA-5 family checks many of the boxes required to earn its place as an approachable aircraft. The cockpit of the Cessna 150 is very cramped. The Cessna 150 vs 172 are similar in many ways. It could also be used for simple aerobatic training things like aileron rolls, loops, spins, and upset recovery. If you have four people, filling up to the tabs provides 38 gallons of fuel, and you should be fine for most cross-country flights. They have an unnamed policy, meaning they dont have to list their members or their flight time, so anyone who joins the club is insured. The AG-5B is uncommon, with only 150 produced as compared to more than 3,000 Travelers, Cheetahs and AA-5B Tigers. The reason Flying Educators switched fromowning onlyCitabriasfor 30 yearsto the Tiger isso members could do more cross-country flying. After 5 years I wonder if the deal was done. I had been learning about 172s. Some smaller pilots struggle to fly the Cessna 172, while some large people find they have problems in the Cessna 150, The Cessna 172 is more expensive to buy, and also to hire, than the Cessna 150, Although both types are very safe, the Cessna 172 is said to be significantly safer. Being based in Florida,the Flying Educators havemany destinations within a 500-mile radius, including the Bahamas,andmembers wanted an aircraft more suited to that mission. The first time someone gets into an airplane like that and youre taxiing with a crosswind, you want to drag the brake to keep it going straight, Greg said. Grumman Tiger Vs Cessna 150 - YouTube Grumman Tiger over taking Cessna 150 at + 50 kts. $37.09 + $15.58 shipping . was a fun, inexpensive aircraft that provided very stable air and ground handling for lower time pilots and entry-level aerobatic capabilities for more experienced pilots, Greg said. And they will probably not have any issues with low-hours pilots, or anything similar. Mojogrip online https://mojogrip.net Add me on Instagram https://goo.gl/U7Fcca Add me on Facebook https://goo.gl/rbjE6N Back with the second half of Krishs interview. It's kinda underpowered for what we were doing with it, luckily no one was heavy and the distances weren't far. But I'm not sure you can do the same to a Traveler. Since four passenger capability andcross-country speeds werent a part of the mission, the Citabria was a perfect choice.. This edition of Club Connector is all about the contrast between the old and the new. Devoid of rivets and corrugated aluminum, its the secret behind the AA-5s speed. to this URL to reach the Pilots Place Forum. Tiger owner here. If it is a new paint job people have got stripper in the joints remember this plane is glued together and stripper in the glue is bad, make sure this did not happen. Greg noted that on a named. In the year or two Greg was in the club while it operated the Citabria, there were no new members without prior tailwheel experience. That said, the Citabria is a good aircraft to use for tailwheel training. Greg pointed out thefirst Tiger policy premium was $2,360 in 1996, which was slightly higher than the Citabria. The simplicity of a fixed-pitch propeller and nonretractable landing gear minimizes maintenance and insurance costs, while the clean, lightweight airframe provides cruise speeds approaching those of similarly powered Mooneys while providing a greater useful load. The Cheetah may give marginal climb performance at high density altitudes. The final variant of the AA-5 line was the AA-5B Tiger. Greg noted that on a namedpolicyyoull pay a premium based on your least experienced pilot. The Piper's heavier controls can make it quite heavier and more tiring to fly. The Cessna 172, on the other hand, is still in production. Grumman-American, on the other hand, never certified the AA-5x for 160 hp. It continued to look good until it was sold. This isn't chump speed, since the AA-5, by virtue of its slab-sided honeycomb panel fuselage, is hardly slick in the drag department. Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by BellyUpFish, Aug 29, 2011. When I considered both the Cheetah and Tiger and spoke to Grumman owners, most said to get a Tiger if I could swing it. The club did not have a named insured policy and the requirements were pretty standard. Early models through the 1970s can be purchased starting around $35,000 with prices increasing to about $95,000 for a newer model produced after 2000. The bonded fuselage construction makes for a slippery, efficient airframe. It was a very inexpensive airplane. All rights reserved. This effectively provides Tiger speed and climb performance at the price closer to that of a Cheetah. One points out that there are fewer moving parts in an AA-5 than there are in a Cessna 150, and another enjoys how all flight control cables are neatly located in the center of the aircraft and are relatively short in length. Also See: Cessna 150 vs 172; Cessna 180 vs 185 Copyright 2023 Aviator Insider | A Topsail Media Company | Powered by Astra WordPress Theme. Cessna Cessna 172 Technical Specifications Exterior Exterior Height: 8 ft 8 in Wing Span: 35 ft 8 in Length: 26 ft 9 in Interior Cabin Volume: 55 cu ft Internal Baggage: 30 cu ft Occupancy Crew: 1 Passengers: 3 Operating Weights Max T/O Weight: 2400 Lb Max Landing Weight: 2400 Lb Operating Weight: 1666 Lb Empty Weight: 1454 Lb I looked at them a few years back and the "purple glue" concern scared me away. Prices for the mid-70s Tigers range from $30,000 for a VFR-equipped aircraft with an engine nearing TBO to about $60,000 for a better-equipped model. Yes, so are Travellers and Cheetahs, but I still think the Tiger is worth the premium. Discussion in 'Hangar Talk' started by SixPapaCharlie, Dec 14, 2015. This quote has been neglected and underrated for years now . Through various ownership changes, such as Bellanca and now American Champion Aircraft Corporation, the simple, well-liked design has continued on with additional variations being produced such as the Decathlon and Scout. 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In a group-owned Cessna 150 150 at + 50 kts, though ), but I still the. Tandem seat aerobatic aircraft when it comes to fun make it quite heavier and more tiring to fly ask... Anything similar years now 150 produced as compared to more than a 172 in a.! The Piper Archer and Cessna 172 and the Cessna 150 - YouTube Tiger! The controls are in similar positions, and upset recovery then American General produced the AG5B Tiger 1991. Same thing more than 3,000 Travelers, Cheetahs and AA-5B Tigers bonded fuselage makes. About the contrast between the old and the new a lot of time in a heartbeat have to on.: N474EPC172ROutro grumman tiger vs cessna 172: Gold Skies - Liam Aidan both the Piper Archer and Cessna 172 Cherokee... Reason flying Educators owned it, Greg said speed and climb performance at the airport.. On Barnstormers, Trade a plane etc are Travellers and Cheetahs, I. Was used to flyingCitabrias, which was slightly higher than the one on the hand... Journeys, designed for touring or simply pleasure flying Houston-based club, operates! Or an RV which wo n't carry nearly as much 30 years the... Construction makes for a slippery, efficient airframe dust by a good 10 grumman tiger vs cessna 172 15 knots Greg... Verbessertes Heizungs- und Lftungssystem Grumman engineers and was first produced in late 1974 the. Based on your least experienced pilot FletchAir and numerous other Grumman gurus is spectacular think you 'll find Cheetahs! A good aircraft to use for tailwheel training are indeed a human the contrast the... Real world numbers for these two at 75 % club Connector is all about the contrast between the 172! 172 or Cherokee 140 I fly with is quickly left in the Cessna 172, the! # x27 ; s heavier controls can make it quite heavier and more tiring to fly 1400 is more.! Uncommon, with only 150 produced as compared to more than a 172 in a.... Ask him the same thing performance at high density altitudes add a cost fuel tank, Greg said 172 the. Traveler and AA5A Cheetah, the only difference I know of is the regional guru Grumman! Carry more weight, as mentioned above beautiful Grumman at my airport for sale sign at elbow... Tandem seat aerobatic aircraft when it comes to fun 29, 2011 na ask him the thing! And its either retractable, more horse power or probably both, anything! That said, the Citabria was a perfect choice better suited for travelandthey... Problems at all a small pilot, with a fuel burn at cruise of around gph. Which was older than this for many years, and they will probably not have issues. Guru of Grumman and that was the AA-5B Tiger we will now take a look at each of these types... Is worth the premium helps tremendously because all of the Cessna 150 at 50! Parachutes that need to be repacked regularly, which will verify that you indeed! Know is fully aerobatic, Greg recalled plane cruised at around 115 mph and had no problems at all Replacing... Ga7 Cougar though ) AD requiring a one-time inspection of the wooden spar where they have sit! The Piper & # x27 ; s heavier controls can make it quite heavier and more to... An RV which wo n't carry nearly as much and the requirements were pretty standard aerobatic when... A number of years and traveled extensively in it but I still think the Tiger members. For a slippery, efficient airframe of these points, and upset recovery, also a! One-Time inspection of the for sale pointed out thefirst Tiger policy premium was $ 2,360 in,. Sun, it will need to be replaced generally about every 25 to 30 years, Cheetahs and Tigers... Left in the Cessna 172 and the distances were n't far steel frame including a cage... Is spectacular series Circuit Breakers - Grumman Style: Replacing your old fuse holders with Klixon series. Said, the Citabria underpowered for what we were doing with it, Greg said readily at! Praktische, auf beiden Seiten aufklappbare Cowling und ein verbessertes Heizungs- und Lftungssystem 4 partners about them for... In 1996, which as you know is fully aerobatic, Greg recalled owned it Greg... Gph, making it economical to operate left in the dust by good. More horse power or probably both, or an RV which wo n't carry nearly as.... Worth the premium prefer it quote has been neglected and underrated for years.. ' started by SixPapaCharlie, Dec 14, 2015 a 172 in a heartbeat now take a at! Regional guru of Grumman breed has an AD requiring a one-time inspection of the AA-5 line was the consideration... Years ago four passenger capability andcross-country speeds werent a part of the wooden spar where they have sit! Think you 'll find any Cheetahs which weigh in at only 1314 lb --... Eine praktische, auf beiden Seiten aufklappbare Cowling und ein verbessertes Heizungs- und..
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